December 01, 2007
How to have an evolution disputation
Before entering any disputation about evolution, it's important to define your terms.
Most of you will know these things, but I'm trying to lay it all out in convenient form. Nor can such a list be complete, but I'll try.
The theory of evolution purports to explain the development of the variety of life. No more no less. As with any scientific theory, it can be examined and disputed. But you need to stay on track.
It does not cover everything in science that may contradict something in Genesis.
The theory of evolution does NOT:
The theory of evolution does NOT say:
Moving right along. If you want to keep on track about evolution and not go into a rant about religion in general, it's necessary also to bear in mind some things about the “intelligent design” movement that may not be well understood by many who are beguiled by it. But you should not bring these points into the argument unless something specific is said that brings it up.
So-called “intelligent design” is NOT the same as the position that God intelligently designed the laws of nature. The whole ”irreducible complexity” line of reasoning has God making explicit exceptions to the laws of nature wherever there's no scientific explanation handy (and sometimes when there really is one).
The whole business of “getting people to acknowledge that there is a God” is a strawman. Like it or not, most people do (at least in the USA), so that's not why they are making a big deal. And even Fundamentalists are apt to be non-literal about unscientific scriptures. For example, no nonsense about the firmament.
It's about preserving the Adam and Eve story against all reason because that story (in the traditional Christian interpretation) is the “historical” basis for why Jesus had to die for our sins.
If you want to argue evolution, keep all that in mind but see if you can't get the other guy to stick to evolution.
But you'll have to do the same.
This is an edited version of a piece I originally posted over by Shermerland.
ETA: The original post from Shermerland.
Most of you will know these things, but I'm trying to lay it all out in convenient form. Nor can such a list be complete, but I'll try.
The theory of evolution purports to explain the development of the variety of life. No more no less. As with any scientific theory, it can be examined and disputed. But you need to stay on track.
It does not cover everything in science that may contradict something in Genesis.
The theory of evolution does NOT:
Explain
the ultimate origin of life. The science for that is still very
speculative at best. And not part of the theory of evolution.
Prove the earth is billions of years old. That's geology not evolution.
Explain the origin of the universe. No, the “Big Bang” is not part of the theory of evolution even though Kent Hovind says it is.
Explain the meaning of life, provide a moral philosophy, replace religion, save your soul, nor require atheism. Nor socialism or whatever. No more than other theories such as Ohm's law or universal gravitation.
Once you've got that down and are really focusing on the theory of evolution: Prove the earth is billions of years old. That's geology not evolution.
Disproof of Noah's flood is also geology not evolution.
Explain the origin of the universe. No, the “Big Bang” is not part of the theory of evolution even though Kent Hovind says it is.
Explain the meaning of life, provide a moral philosophy, replace religion, save your soul, nor require atheism. Nor socialism or whatever. No more than other theories such as Ohm's law or universal gravitation.
The theory of evolution does NOT say:
That
life arose by “random happenstance”. This is supposed to be the
crusher. Disproofs of evolution based on the improbability of “random
happenstance” are irrelevant because that's not what the theory says.
Random mutation is just part of the raw material. Natural selection is
not random at all.
That we're “nothing but” animals. The “nothing but” animal does not exist. It's not just religious folks who make this particular mistake about evolution.
That we're monkeys. That negroes are closer to monkeys than white folks. Or anything like that.
That we're “nothing but” animals. The “nothing but” animal does not exist. It's not just religious folks who make this particular mistake about evolution.
That we're monkeys. That negroes are closer to monkeys than white folks. Or anything like that.
Moving right along. If you want to keep on track about evolution and not go into a rant about religion in general, it's necessary also to bear in mind some things about the “intelligent design” movement that may not be well understood by many who are beguiled by it. But you should not bring these points into the argument unless something specific is said that brings it up.
So-called “intelligent design” is NOT the same as the position that God intelligently designed the laws of nature. The whole ”irreducible complexity” line of reasoning has God making explicit exceptions to the laws of nature wherever there's no scientific explanation handy (and sometimes when there really is one).
The whole business of “getting people to acknowledge that there is a God” is a strawman. Like it or not, most people do (at least in the USA), so that's not why they are making a big deal. And even Fundamentalists are apt to be non-literal about unscientific scriptures. For example, no nonsense about the firmament.
It's about preserving the Adam and Eve story against all reason because that story (in the traditional Christian interpretation) is the “historical” basis for why Jesus had to die for our sins.
If you want to argue evolution, keep all that in mind but see if you can't get the other guy to stick to evolution.
But you'll have to do the same.
This is an edited version of a piece I originally posted over by Shermerland.
ETA: The original post from Shermerland.
Posted by: Abdul Alhazred at
02:36 PM
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